Don’t Know Much About History: it’s not just kids
I’m a freak about history. I’m utterly obsessed with it. Since early childhood, I have felt compelled to find out, well, pretty much everything that has ever happened on this planet. Yeah, I know. Ridiculous. But it keeps me going, and is one reason I am never, ever bored.
It’s self-evident to me that you can’t possibly understand the present without understanding the past. There is no aspect of modern life that doesn’t become radically clarified when you understand all the stuff that led up to it. So the widespread ignorance of history is continually appalling to me.
I offer that by way of introduction to this article at the Wall Street Journal. David McCullough is bewailing the historical illiteracy of “young people.” For example:
Mr. McCullough began worrying about the history gap some 20 years ago, when a college sophomore approached him after an appearance at “a very good university in the Midwest.” She thanked him for coming and admitted, “Until I heard your talk this morning, I never realized the original 13 colonies were all on the East Coast.” Remembering the incident, Mr. McCullough’s snow-white eyebrows curl in pain. “I thought, ‘What have we been doing so wrong that this obviously bright young woman could get this far and not know that?’”
I feel his eyebrow pain.
The bullshit aspect of the article is the hackles-raising reference to “political correctness” as one of the reasons for this situation. Aside from the problems with “political correctness” as a concept, the fact is, most people are wildly ignorant of history, geography, literature, and pretty much anything that happened before they were born or outside their personal area of interest. And that includes people who graduated from good schools back in the days of Dead White Men history curricula.
To prove my point, I decided to share with you a few of the jaw-dropping remarks I’ve collected over the years. These were all made by people with graduate degrees. Graduate degrees. Not high school seniors, not undergraduates, but people with a master’s degree or a doctorate in something. Dig it:
- “The Civil War was before World War I, right?”
- “Does India have a coastline? It’s a landlocked country, isn’t it?”
- “Why did the Jewish people in Ben-Hur have slaves? Hadn’t they just been freed from slavery in Egypt?”
- “Who is this ‘Apostle Paul’ you’re referring to?”
- “A Christmas Carol is the only thing by Shakespeare I’m really familiar with.”
- Person 1: “Who was Lee Harvey Oswald?” Person 2: “I’m not sure. Some political guy I think.”
- “I know England has always been a really heavily Catholic country.”
- “Was the Norman Conquest before or after the discovery of America?”
- “English is a Romance language. It’s descended from Latin.”
Most of the people who said those things aren’t stupid. They’re quite good at what they do and intellectually bright in many areas. They’re just not tuned in. Data about the world and the past washes over them, unnoticed, the same way mathematics washes over most of us. (And if you’re thinking that some of those jaw-droppers aren’t strictly about matters of historical knowledge, consider: if you have a solid grounding in the history of civilization, then you know that India is a sub-continent and English is a Germanic language.)
For most people, history—like math—is an acquired taste. And so the teaching of it is critical. McCullough is right that history needs to be presented in a way that engages and excites.
I also think it needs to be integrated into other subjects, from first grade through graduate school. Psychology students, for example: all you have to do is read Psychology Today, or pretty much any paper by any ev-psycho, to realize that knowledge of world history and culture isn’t a big part of your average psychology curriculum. And it should be. Think of how much junk science we would be spared!
40 Responses to “Don’t Know Much About History: it’s not just kids”
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Ciardha says:
I feel the same, and not just about Euro-American history.
Back in college I astonished my friends that were Japanese exchange students by being able to talk at length about Japanese history, not just dates and battles but talk about how and when Japanese women’s status declined from the early historical matricentric to patriarchal and how this change happened over hundreds of years starting with the court nobles- strongly influenced by the importation of Chinese culture- especially Confucian notions of social order and Buddhist theology. It took around 700 years to strongly affect even the samurai class and around thousand years to do so to merchants, artisans and farmers. They did not expect an American, even one who liked Japanese pop culture to know their history so well. (Most the women I was friends with at least leaned feminist- a fact not many westerners knew back in the late 1980′s. This wasn’t unusual for the generation of Japanese women born in the 1960′s and early 1970′s. They felt freer to be open about it in the US back then as Japanese feminism was just starting a third wave in action and influence more like our second wave. A wave that still continues and is lead by the women of that generation- like the current head of the Japan’s Socialist party- Mizuho Fukushima. (I’ve read this woman’s policy stances and actions and could only wish we had a strong political voice like hers… I’d love to see her become Japan’s first women prime minister. I know if I could I’d vote for her in a heartbeat.
June 19th, 2011 at 1:25 am EST -
Unree says:
Couple of years ago I read a library copy of “The Rise of Theodore Roosevelt” on a cross-country flight. (I loved the book and recommend it to everyone here, even though the author and his subject are/were conservative guys.) The man next to me kept gawping. Eventually I made friendly eye contract. He said, “I didn’t think women liked History.” The capital H was there.
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Unree says:
Eye contact, the doofus meant to type! Preview is my friend.
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angie says:
None of those top one from a girl I met in college who thought it was “So cool how Mount Rushmore looked like those presidents.” The girl actually thought the sculptures of Washington, Jefferson, T. Roosevelt & Lincoln were a natural phenomena (if she actually even knew what a natural phenomena was).
And you are far kinder than I, because I put down all those remarks to stupidity — or at least, the lack of curiosity, which is a mark of stupidity, IMO. How can you learn of the 13 colonies & not be curious to know which states comprised those 13 colonies? Knowing the names of those states should clue you into them all being on the East Coast (if it wasn’t already readily apparent from the rest of US History — Louisiana Purchase, western expansion, CA gold rush, etc).
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myiq2xu says:
I got my BA in History, and I never understood why people find the topic boring. But I concluded long ago that a big part of the problem is that it is badly taught.
I don’t blame history teachers, I blame the system.
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Ugsome says:
I love history. I am very frustrating conversation partner, however, because I don’t often retain the details but simply the major themes, which is usually People are Being Assholes Again. It’s still a worthwhile exercise however because at least it sharpens your bullshit detector. (I often read something and think, “That can’t be right! Lemme go look that up/ask someone.”)
You’re right that youth has always been going to the dogs. My father, a professor, said the first time he felt old was in the early 60s, when a student raised his hand in class and asked, “When was World War II”?
Interesting point about psychology and history. I asked my dad 30 years ago why isn’t history part of the psychology curriculum? and his face lit up; he thought the same thing.
I live in France and have to get up to speed on my country of adoption, so right now I am reading Julian Jackson’s history of Vichy France. (I recommend the France since 1871 course, including the book, at http://oyc.yale.edu/history/france-since-1871.)
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ellie says:
The teaching method that McCullough suggests we use, a constructivist method, requires time to let the student discover the truths herself. Our national curriculum standards, no matter what subject they’re written for, require that teachers present so much material in one year that subjects are “covered” rather than “uncovered”. The curriculum becomes “a mile wide and an inch deep”. Those of us who believe that if you teach using methods that excite and engage students, you create a student for life are shouted down by the people who believe that you have to cram all of the details of every subject down a student’s throat in 13 years because people stop learning when they leave school. Those people have won, and it is a self-fulfilling prophecy. Plans to reward teachers who produce good test scores based on tests that require mile wide, inch deep curriculum will further cement the teaching methods that “cover” rather than “uncover” learning.
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Teresainpa says:
I have always thought of history as one more great book to read ,or series of books really, except it was real. You could go to those places where history happened and you could think about how your ancestors fit in to the world and why they came to America when they did, or how geography, sociology, language etc… tie in to why events unfolded as they did.
I am not sure how a person who reads for pleasure can avoid knowing at least the basics about American and European history. -
anna says:
I’m really interested in American women’s history. Violet, can you recommend any books on that subject? Thanks.
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The gold digger says:
I was reading Army of Angels, which is about Joan of Arc. A co-worker, who had gone to nice private schools in Colombia, and had gotten his MBA at Northwestern, which did not accept me, which ended up being OK because I went to UT and paid about 20% of what NW would have cost, asked what the book was about.
“Joan of Arc,” I told him.
“Who’s that?” he asked.
I thought he was joking but he was not.
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votermom says:
As a kid I became interested in history via fiction (and myths & legends). I would read a novel and think “no way! that did not really happen, did it?” and find out more.
Today I think the American Girl company does a pretty good effort of integrating history, toys, and entertainment. -
tinfoil hattie says:
I did not study history at all. I never had a “history” class in grade school or in high school. We had “social studies,” which largely replaced history. In high school, when I could have chosen history classes, I instead selected things like “Ideas in America” and “Civil Rights,” because I had no idea history could even be interesting.
I regret not learning history in school, and am considering just taking a couple of overview classes at the local community college. I don’t know whom/what I “blame” for my lack of education in history, but I now know I can begin to address it. Don’t get me wrong – I know American history fairly well, but have never had an in-depth education in it. This thread is motivating me to change that.
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Ciardha says:
An horridly shocking one I overheard once was- “Who did the US fight the revolution against? Was it China?” My jaw dropped open.
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angie says:
tinfoil hattie — you know, you don’t have to take a class (and pay tuition) to study history — there are tons of books on every aspect of history that you can imagine. For example, I love the Tudors & have read several books on Henry VIII, his six wives & Elizabeth I. My dad, OTOH, who wanted to major in History in college (but decided on Engineering for a better paying job with a BS) is a WWII buff — he regularly reads books concerning that war.
So, despite whatever formal education you may have had, anyone who has the curiosity (and you seem to have that) & a library card can “learn” history on their own. It isn’t something like Calculus where it is really more effective to have a teacher/tutor to explain the principles (of course, one can be learn Calculus on your own, but I think it isn’t quite as “easy” as picking up a copy of The Rise & Fall of the Third Reich IMO). -
Ciardha says:
I wholeheartedly agree with angie- I learned far more about history outside of the classroom than inside. I was fascinated by all kinds of history since I was a child and I devoured all kinds of books connected to the study of history since I was a child. Tinfoil hattie, take a trip to your local public library and start with an aspect of history that interests you most- individuals? Biographies, autobiographies or collections of letters, etc… I just read “My Dearest Friend” an extensive selection of the letters exchanged between Abigail and John Adams, from their courtship until his retirement from the presidency. It was a fascinating study of them through their own words.
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angie says:
BTW — I also love biographies as I find most even more interesting than fiction. For the last 2 years I’ve been on a tear reading about females — I’ve read bios on Eleanor Roosevelt, Catherine the Great, Marie Antoinette, Mary, Queen of Scots, Tsarina Alexandra, Queen Victoria, Eleanor of Aquitaine, & my beloved Elizabeth I etc. Not only have they been interesting to me personally, I’ve also found it extremely telling that all of the biographies on females I’ve read in the last 2 years have been written by female authors/scholars. I guess the male writers didn’t find the subject matter important enough.
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tinfoil hattie says:
angie & ciardha, thanks – and I’d love any ideas about where to start, since I don’t have any particular “love” for any period (yet). What a great idea! My library is across the street.
Thx, and I’ll take suggestions from anyone!
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Sameol says:
If you’re interested in England, The Weaker Vessel
by Antonia Fraser is great, and if you’re interested in the WWI era or radical history, Living My Life by Emma Goldman really pulls together a lot of those threads. -
djmm says:
I love history and geography. I once mentioned Singapore in a conversation — a friend thought it was the capital of Japan.
djmm
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Nessum says:
While I prefer reading to say, watching tv series, I still had been looking forward to the series “John Adams”. Unfortunately I had to stop watching early on as I simply couldn’t stand Paul Giamatti. Can’t explain why.
Never lasted long watching “The Tudors” either. It bothered me to no end that the actors all looked like what they were: 21st century people with 21st century hair, makeup, speech, and manners. Don’t know why they even bothered to put them in costumes.
Much better to make your own inner pictures. :) I too will recommend Antonia Fraser’s “Marie Antoinette: The Journey”. Mesmerizing and thoroughly researched. Great book and great reading.
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Nessum says:
Oh, and djmm: Geography gaffes? Please let’s not go there. :D
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Nessum says:
From more recent history, I came across this interesting, in an unsettling kind of way, article from spiegel.de Book Reveals Extent of Third Reich Body Worship. There are some baffling quotes in the interview, like
“We want a strong and joyful affirmation of body awareness, because we need it to build a strong and self-confident race.” Nudity was seen partly as a means of encouraging the “health of the race.” And if that also happened to serve the voyeuristic desires of readers, that was accepted.
And watching the photos you’ll notice that the “private parts” of the men are covered while the women show their full Eve-costume. What’s up with that?
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votermom says:
tinfoil hattie, I second the library idea.
One way to “browse” historyv is to visit nearby historical sites, museums, historical societies, heritage societies, etc and just sight-see for a bit and see what strikes an interest in you and then use the library to learn more. -
Carmonn says:
tinfoil hattie, even if you’ve already read A People’s History of the United States, I’d recommend skimming through it again. Zinn uses a lot of primary sources so it’s a good jumping off point after you identify the periods that interest you the most.
I agree with votermom, historical sites have fantastic book selections in a wide range of areas these days.
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angie says:
@tinfoil hattie — I too recommend Antonia Fraser’s “Marie Antoinette: The Journey” (as Nessum does). Also, Alison Weir’s “The Six Wives of Henry the VIII” and “The Life of Elizabeth I.” And Virginia Rounding’s “Catherine the Great” (spoiler alert — her infamous death story with the horse? NOT TRUE! Just a nasty bit of propaganda from the men who didn’t want another female ruler in Russia. I had actually heard that rumor in school & taken it as fact!).
As you can see, I’m biography heavy in my recommendations because that’s what I’ve been reading lately, but thinking about what you write that there isn’t a particular aspect of history that intrigues you, I think it would be good to start with a person intrigues you — whoever that is — Ghandi, Amelia Earhart, whoever — any biography you read will include the “history” too, so perhaps by doing that you will find an era that you will be interested in to learn more about. I’m actually really excited that you are going to start!
@Ciardha — I’m going out to get “My Dearest Friend” tomorrow. Thanks!
Someone mentioned the John Adams mini-series — I really enjoyed it. I read David McCullough’s biography “John Adams” & I recommend it too. In fact, I’ve read a few David McCullough biographies (“Truman” and “Mornings on Horseback” which is about Teddy Roosevelt) and I recommend David McCullough in general, because his writing style is very “novel-like” & easy to read.
@Nessum – don’t even get me started on Showtime’s The Tudors. I’m not trying to pass myself off as an “expert” on the Tudors, but even I can see that soap opera (from the clothing to the major events) is completely inaccurate. The lead guy is very good looking but come on! Henry VIII was TALL (although he didn’t get corpulent as he is usually thought of until later in life, he had a strong build & was barrel-chested) and had RED-HAIR. If they were going to go with this slight, short guy, couldn’t they have at least died his hair red for the part? And really, that isn’t the worst of it — Cardinal Wolsey killing himself? No. Didn’t happen. I had to stop watching the show after the first season. As I said, I’m not an “expert” on The Tudors, but I’m pretty sure I would have enjoyed the show more if I had known less.
I think I’ve written enough. If I don’t stop now, I’ll write my own book! :-)
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angie says:
Um, that should have been “dyed his hair red.” Why can’t I remember to use “preview” before posting?
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votermom says:
OT: Violet & RL readers, by any chance have you read this book that was reviewed here? It sounds interesting:
Unnatural Selection: Choosing Boys Over Girls and the Consequences of a World Full of Men
By Mara Hvistendahl -
blondie says:
I agree with those above who suggested reading biographies as a fun way of learning history, and I second the recommendation to read McCullough’s John Adams. I would also suggest a novel to awaken interest in Lewis and Clark’s expedition, I Should Be Extremely Happy In Your Company. If you’d like to watch something, Ken Burns has several great mini-series about varieties of topics to “make history come to life.”
The internet is, of course, an amazing resource for learning; so long as you freely exercise your right to skepticism and verification that what you’re reading is accurate. E.g., Ellis Island has a great website. There are a lot of historical figures/groups/locales about whom someone has created cool sites with lots of information.
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Allison says:
Biographies also opened up history for me. When I got started I read a fascinating collection of letters – “Letters from Liselotte” – Duchess of Orleans in the 17th century.
Two good ones about the Tudors:
“The Autobiography of Henry VIII” by Margaret George
“The Sunne in Splendour” by Sharon Kay PenmanMost recently I picked up a biography of Jean Harlow at the thrift store – “Harlow” by Irving Shulman.
So many people and events – how could you ever get bored!?
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Swannie says:
I discovered history in a Catholic School , in the library in a popular secular history series that someone had donated to the library. Naive as I was , I went to the librarian and asked why a certain character Sacagawea, on the LEWIS AND CLARKE EXPEDITION had been left out of our history texts. Those books were promptly removed from the library. BUT … I discovered that Catholics were not the only people in history that had done anything important in the world, and never looked back :) Are you all familiar with MAX DASHU’s Work ?? Max Dashu founded the Suppressed Histories Archives in 1970 to research and document women’s history from an international perspective. She has photographed some 15,000 slides and created 100 slideshows on female power and heritages transhistorically.
http://www.suppressedhistories.net/aboutmax.html -
Adrienne in CA says:
Historiann presents a different take on McCullough here.
Historiann on 20 Jun 2011 at 9:40 pm #
It doesn’t matter what a supposed college sophomore 20 years ago thought about the “original” American colonies. She’s a stock character in a story he’s telling, so I don’t really take her seriously.
What matters is McCullough’s own severely blinkered view of American history, which was the larger point of the post. He is thoroughly satisfied by the idea that the “13 original [English] colonies” is a self-evident fact, whereas I suggest that we think more broadly about who exactly was “original” and what’s a “colony,” and why do we want to limit it to 13, and what’s the ideological goal of talking about just the English jurisdictions on the Atlantic littoral?
People like McCullough criticize the professional study and production of history as though they’re objective, neutral observers, when they’ve actually got a narrow political agenda of their own.
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angie says:
Adrienne — I’m actually aware of the critics of McCullough and I myself also read more “scholarly” works. However many of those are akin to reading text books & I stand by my recommendation that McCullough is a good place to “start” for the exact reason that he doesn’t bog his books down in those kinds of “what are the 13 colonies” kind of questions. There certainly is a place for those kinds of work & I’m not advocating that one should look at merely one perspective to truly “learn” any aspect of history BUT none of McCullough’s critics claim he is *innacurrate* — the complaint is that he isn’t “scholarly” enough for their erudite taste. BS — while I wouldn’t quote him in a graduate dissertation, his works are enjoyable & provide a good amount of info in an accessible manner. I stand by my recommendation. I completely enjoyed the 3 biographies of his that I read.
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Allison says:
@30 – Swannie! OMGosh – the best biographical novel EVAH – “Sacajawea” by Anna Lee Waldo. It’s 1,000 pages and when you get to the end you wish there was more.
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Sweet Sue says:
Allison, I mean no offense at all, but please don’t say that “Harlow” or Harlot, as I like to call it, is a biography.
It’s a novel written by a dirty, old man that defames and trashes the legacy of a Hollywood great because she was a sexy woman who died at the age of twenty six.
There’s no one left to defend Jean Harlow but that book is the detritus of a prurient, old creep’s wankfest. -
anna says:
The Equal Rights Amendment just got reintroduced in the House of Representatives. http://www.msmagazine.com/news.....p?ID=13073
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Sameol says:
To be fair, Historiann’s main problem with McCullough seems to be that (in her opinion) he’s denigrating academic and professional historians in an ignorant, out-of-date and stereotypical way. She’s not so much attacking him as responding to what she perceives as his attacks by focusing on his own biases and shortcomings.
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Swannie says:
Allison Thank you ! I just read EVE’S SEED , Biology the Sexes and the Course of History ,by Robert S. McElvaine.Loved it.
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Swannie says:
Also just read SISTERS OF FORTUNE by JEHANNE WAKE So intersting.
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truesilver says:
I love history *and* math. Thank you for this post.:)Loved it and agree with every word !
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Nancy W says:
My mom always read a lot of historical fiction when I was a kid, so I absorbed a lot of information just talking with her about books. Between the TV Westerns and Disney, I think most kids I knew had a passing acquaintance with the American Revolution and the westward expansion. So even if I hadn’t actually paid attention in history class, I would have known some American history.
In my forties I became interested in tracing my family tree and all of that information came flooding back as I tried to make sense of how my family ended up where they are today. The Irish famine & diaspora, the earlier Scots-Irish immigration to the US, coal-mining practices, religious politics, road-building and transportation history, the growth of the steel industry – everything became personal and more interesting. Start reading at the point that grabs you first – for me it was reading the 1880 census and picturing the woman holding my one-month-old great-grandfather in her arms as she talked to the census taker. I wanted to know who she was.
